Why we can’t do ~600MHz yet

by no2chem 10. September 2009 22:46

Ever since the release of nueOverClockTest, I’ve got several inquiries on “why can’t there be a 600MHz setting? It would probably be much more stable”. Well, the short answer is – I haven’t found how to get to that setting yet. Since Qualcomm would rather keep information about it’s coveted MSM line a secret, I basically have to guess how to get things to work.

I’ve figured out my problem with changing the “L-Value” of BackPll0/1 – I need to change it when it isn’t selected as the ARM11 SubSystem’s core clock. However, it’s still pretty unstable, and a value of 0x5 makes the device slow as heck. What’s even more perplexing is the default value, which seems to be 0x7. If that is multiplied against the 19.2 MHz TCXO clock, we get something like 134 MHz. Perhaps I’m looking at the wrong place, or I got the meaning of the registers wrong.

I’ve found the registers that control the voltage exactly, not just levels 0-7, but writing to them seems to have no effect. It seems that I don’t understand the PMIC well enough yet to get complete control over it.

I’m still evaluating our options to figure out what’s best, but its starting to lean more and more towards figuring out how to get the ARM9 to execute code for us without hacking the radio rom.

Anyways, this raises a question that’s been on the back of my head for awhile now – why the heck does Qualcomm think it’s necessary to keep all information on the MSM chipsets confidential? I doubt its because they’re afraid the competition is going to steal all their secrets, because I doubt the documentation HTC engineers use could help a competitor of Qualcomm in any real way… Making the documentation public would probably get more developers on the device, increasing their sales volume… Alas, I fail to understand Qualcomm… Perhaps I should send them an e-mail asking for information.

Regarding 0.4, there’s nothing yet to show in a version 0.4, so relax, calm down, when I have something to show you, it’ll come out in version 0.4.

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Comments


People's Republic of China Jiwan 
August 14. 2009 06:55 | Reply
Jiwan
I think it because Qualcomm uses some technologies made by 3rd companies, but didnt license it


United States atlboy 
August 15. 2009 07:32 | Reply
atlboy
also do you know if there is any difference b/w 7200's and 7600's?
Nice work btw.


Netherlands Chaosstorm 
August 15. 2009 14:14 | Reply
Chaosstorm
So.. you want to use the radio arm9 processor for programs? woudnt that make the phone radio unstable like when you get a call the processor gets too much work and you cant answer it? Tong


Spain Adrian 
August 15. 2009 18:07 | Reply
Adrian
Continue figthing! Asking qualcomm it's a good point to start!


Spain Adrian 
August 16. 2009 09:44 | Reply
Adrian
OH MY GOOOD WORKING ON ANDROID!!!!!!

daproy  
Member
  
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 81



Well I played around with this a bit. Pulled cyanogen's latest kernel code with BFS from github. Patched acpuclock.c (patchfile attached). Compiled with the android toolchain.

First off there is definitely something wrong with the kernel i compiled because it was horrible slow to boot. I did use the .config from cyanogen 4.1.6 without edits so I'm not sure why. I can't imagine it was due to the patch since with default min and max scaling it should be running the same as the kernel compiled by cyanogen.

Regardless, I was able to try to overclocking:
Code:
# echo 528000 > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_min_freq
# echo 768000 > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_max_freq
# cat /proc/cpuinfo                                                  
Processor  : ARMv6-compatible processor rev 2 (v6l)
BogoMIPS  : 527.15
Features  : swp half thumb fastmult edsp java
CPU implementer  : 0x41
CPU architecture: 6TEJ
CPU variant  : 0x1
CPU part  : 0xb36
CPU revision  : 2

Hardware  : trout
Revision  : 0080
Serial    : 0000000000000000
# echo 768000 > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_min_freq
# cat /proc/cpuinfo                                                  
Processor  : ARMv6-compatible processor rev 2 (v6l)
BogoMIPS  : 766.77
Features  : swp half thumb fastmult edsp java
CPU implementer  : 0x41
CPU architecture: 6TEJ
CPU variant  : 0x1
CPU part  : 0xb36
CPU revision  : 2

Hardware  : trout
Revision  : 0080
Serial    : 0000000000000000

It reboot immediately following the cpuinfo but looks like it did scale up to 768000

Phone is fine after the reboot and back to default min max freq.

Before trying to toy around with different AHB clock dividers I should probably work out getting a good kernel to compile first, unless cyanogen has some spare time and feels like taking a look at this. I know I won't have any spare time in the next few days.


Netherlands Chaosstorm 
August 17. 2009 02:59 | Reply
Chaosstorm
lol Adrian seems you will make alot of android users with QMSM7xxx happy ^^


August 17. 2009 06:52 | Reply
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August 17. 2009 23:19 | Reply
Kane3162
im not shitting you... why hasnt M$FT hired you and asked you to do everything for them for loads of cash... anyone with a PPC with WMobile and has ever ventured into finding apps for their phone has come across your work... I mean seriously?


United States Qualcomm is the worst 
August 18. 2009 08:15 | Reply
Qualcomm is the worst
Qualcomm licenses features of the CPU separately.  Yeah, you bought the CPU but you pay extra for 3D acceleration drivers or using the GPS.  They're a patent warehouse and haven't done anything relevant since EVDO, which has been more than a few years.


Spain Adrian 
August 18. 2009 15:51 | Reply
Adrian
Sadly i'm not the developer of this kernel patch, I pasted an extract of XDA-Developers, but the original poster nick was not pasted. The real developer of this patch it's "daproy" in XDA-Developers.

No2chem, continue investigating please, we need to investigate a way to reach 6xx Mhz...


Netherlands chaosstorm 
August 18. 2009 16:16 | Reply
chaosstorm
Ah ok Tong still good you linked it here :p

succes with your research No2chem


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United States ring-b 
December 11. 2009 04:50 | Reply
ring-b
No2Chem, where did you go dude?  Please please come back and help us overclock these Qualcomm processors.  I hope Qualcomm didn't kidnap you.  


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A quick question - is version 0.4 released yet?




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June 9. 2010 16:34 | Reply
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Well, the short answer is – I haven’t found how to get to that setting yet. Since Qualcomm would rather keep information about it’s coveted MSM line a secret, I basically have to guess how to get things to work.


Romania Mircea I 
June 12. 2010 23:39 | Reply
Mircea I
134MHz sounds a lot like the AHB clock - so you might very well be looking at the wrong cfg reg. You'd need to manipulate the AXI clock - the bus the ARM core is directly connected to - instead. I might be talking shit, but it was like this in the two SoC datasheets I've got to read until now. None Qualcomm, but both ARM-based.

Also, you're probably looking after a PLL cfg reg, rather than a clock divider. The ones (again, only 2) I've seen had 4 parameters:
- band select, which tells the PLL what input frequency range is expected, and controls the reference, VCO and output frequency ranges - normally 2 bits
- input frequency divider; fREF = fIN / in_div
- VCO frequency multiplier; fVCO = fREF * vco_mul
- output frequency divier: fOUT = fVCI / out_div
These parameters may, or may not, be located in the same config register(s); but if they did, you'd expect more something like 0x1103C instead for the PLL config. I do hope they're not, in your case.

Btw, the designs I've seen have one PLL that produces a "master clock" and all other clocks (driving the buses, basically) are obtained by frequency division. So you might be looking for the multiplier N such that, given two integer dividers, A for AHB and a B AXI frequency, would yield fAHB==fIN*N/A and at the same time fAXI==fIN*N/B. AHB is almost certainly running at 133MHz.


Romania Mircea I 
June 12. 2010 23:51 | Reply
Mircea I
P.S. As for why wouldn't Qualcomm provide the docs - AFAIK, the business model in this industry is that you'd provide the docs for free, watermarked with the customer company's name, to _clients of your development boards_ (which are expensive as hell btw, and called "evaluation systems" to support the pricing). All the clients will sign extensive NDAs, of course.

Furthermore, you normally have ONE silicon die you package in several products ("chips"), however with different pinouts (basically on anything but the flagship product you don't connect to pins those pads related to functionality that's "not" in the product). Of course, the documentation you ship only covers those functions that "are" in the chip you ship - even though it IS physically available. This is particularly important for IP that doesn't need pins - say, multimedia codecs and the like.

And last, to protect your investment, when you package the silicon die, you add some corrosive substance which reacts with the air, so if anybody opens up the chip, it will see the remains of the die, fubar. This does wonders to prevent reverse-engineering.

Let's get this straight. Qualcomm sells chips. They're not interested in having a developer base, but in selling as many as possible, while discouraging the competition severely. So you will never ever see that kind of docs, unless under NDA.




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